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All 29 posts Subject: my pill press Please login to post Down

Agni
(Stranger)
10-14-04 02:16
No 535741
      my pill press

My digital camera is dead again, so i made a flash movie of my press in action. If anyone is interested i can post diretions on how to make it. i put my press onto a normal 15 ton shop press and presed down on the top. i produce 4 pills every 2 minutes with this, though the design could esily be made larger to produce many more. the pills are hard and stay together(mdma). hope this upload works...

jackhole
(Hive Bee)
10-14-04 03:09
No 535747
      Post!

Post!

Jizzy Jizzy Bang Bang

Bond_DoubleBond
(Hive Bee)
10-14-04 03:19
No 535748
      Sweet

Indeed. Please post.

Astrum
(Stranger)
10-14-04 04:45
No 535760
      Sexy

Very sexy smile

-Jaych

psytech
(Hive Bee)
10-14-04 05:10
No 535763
      more

do u have any details

ApprenticeCook
(Hive Addict)
10-14-04 06:49
No 535782
      Yeah i would like to see some pictures.

Yeah i would like to see some pictures.

Hand operated? how did you achieve the required pressure??

Would love to see some pics so we can see how it operates and pics of sample output pills.... what are they like? good as one wants them to be???

Schematics on how we can all build one would be good! we can even inscribe a design copyright on the side.... laugh

Good work though, flash animation looks like a good mechanical method being used.

-AC

Its just my opinion, but no-one listens to me anyway, and rightly so...

indole_amine
(Hive Bee)
10-14-04 17:08
No 535833
User Picture       adulterants

Pressure: Car jack hydraulics?

sample output pills.... what are they like?
probably depends on the fillers and binders used..

..has anyone a suggested "recipe" for making nice, smooth pills that don't break apart when touched tongue ?

Common ingredients are:
SiO2 and talcum are used to allow for a nice flow of the unpressed pulverized material - anti-caking agent, so to say... (probably not needed here)
mannitol, lactose, fructose or cellulose ("microcrystalline" type) help in keeping the goods together
lubricating agents like magnesium stearate are used to avoid having the pills stuck in the machine...
coating can be done to make things easier to swallow (MDMA has a nasty taste!): it can consist of color, sugar, water, cellulose derivatives, polyvinyls and/or gums and is sprayed over the pressed raw pills, followed by hot air drying

_{indole_amine}

jboogie
(Newbee)
10-15-04 02:36
No 535905
      Pressure: Car jack hydraulics?

Pressure: Car jack hydraulics?
swiz used a pair of bench vises that he cranked the shit out of.
..has anyone a suggested "recipe" for making nice, smooth pills that don't break apart when touched ?
the key factor to noncrumbly pills is the presure involved with the press. it didnt make much difference in the mix of binders. i used ta watch this guy wink -who lives in siberia btw- mix up batches and it only took talc and mcc to make a pill. i would suggest looking up the pharma-purdue patient on the binders in oxycontin-not the new smartpills; the old oxys had a minalmal amount of weird fillers... just dont press the pills to 50,000lbs like they do the oxy or youll probably shit it out whole. the other important ingredient was food grade wax spray. the pressed pills were shaken up in a plastic bag blown up with air after they were sprayed with a lite coat of food grade edible wax sealer.
swiz had something similiar, without the springed top. basicly an inch thick bar of aluminium with staggerd rows of holes drilled thru. another block with corrasponding dowls. locking backplate.
there were other factors also. the pills had to have some moisture for the binders to work at all. if they were moist when they came out- which they were- then someswim had to spread all the pills out to dry or condinsation would form in the bag or bottle and they get crumbly again. swify found heating the plate while they were pressing to bee nice and the addition of one of those little desk heaters that barly blows hot air perfect. the key is to dry the pill quickly without making the inner moisture turn to steam. smile

Dont let them select Bush again in 2004.

Agni
(Stranger)
10-17-04 23:26
No 536251
      finally

Parts:

part    Qty

1" thick by 6" wide by 6" long    3
Stainless steel block.

1" thick by 4" wide by 10" long    1
Stainless steel block.

springs 8" long normaly 4
open. make sure they arnt to hard
to compress

very strong rods the same diameter 4
you want your pills to be and 4"
long. I used 1/2" S.S.

S.S. rods also 1/2" diameter 10" long    4

S.S. rods also 1/2" diameter 6" long    1

Procedure:

Line up 1 of the 1"x6"x6" stainless steel with the 1"x4"x6"
so that the 1"x4"x6" piece is lined up with the 1"x6"x6" piece
in the middle. then place one other 1"x6"x6" piece on the top of the stack of metal.

Drill 4 holes with the 1/2 inch drill bit. make the 4 holes 1" apart and 2" from the sides of the top piece. drill all the way through the first two and 1/3" into the bottom piece. Note that you drill the holes 1" apart from the center of the hole so as the actual holes are 1/2" apart.A drill press is almost essential for this.

remove the middle pice of metal. stack the two drilled 1"x4"x6" and the remaining undrilled 1"x4"x6" piece, on top of eachother so that the holes line up. on all four corners drill all the way through make the holes 4.5" apart so that the blue piece can snugly go in and out between the holes (rods will be in the holes) and make them 4.5" apart the other length.

weld or epoxy the four 4" long rods into the 1"x4"x6" that has the four center holes that only go in 1/3 of an inch. it is very important that these rods are inserted 100% perpendicular to the metal. make sure they are very sturdy.

take the larger metal block and on the far side from the holes drill a hole all the way through and epoxy or weld the 6" rod into the hole for a handle

weld or epoxy the four long rods into the 1"x4"x6" block with out the center holes, so that the rods are perfectly perpendicular to the block and all the same height.

now its time to put it all together:

start with the last block you worked on (the one with the long rods). on top of it place the longer block with the handle. next place the 1"x4"x6" block that has the 4 holes in the center on top make so the long metal rods go straight threw the outer holes. now put the four springs on the long rods. lastly put the 1"x4"x6" block with the 4 shorter rods onto the long rods, on top of the springs so that the short rods point straight down.

I added this part later, its not in the flassh instructions. if the press is used as it is some of the pill powder will slip between the mold and the block with the handle, making a pill taht has a large odd shapped base, kinda looks liek a hat... to make sure this dosent happend i welded the mold block to the bottm block, with the sliding piece in. make sure the weld (or epoxy) holds the two blocks together very tightly , so that the sliding block can still move but its very tight.

Another thing i added later was larger hoels in the sliding block. the larger holes make the pills fall out easier when your done. i simply increased the hoels on the sliding pice with a larger drill bit.

to use the press:
place the whole press into a shop press, of at least 10 tons, (hrdrulic car jacks work great!) pull the sliding piece so that the holes are not lined up.(see flash video) scrape your pill powder into the holes, do not compact it! make sure its very loose for pill consistency. lower the press so that the rods on the top block compress teh pill pwder, compress untill you can compress anymore. release the shop pressso that the springs push the top block back up. move the sliding blokk so the holes are lined up again. now press the pill like before. pull the sliding block out. your pills should be nice and uniform, make sure you catch em when they come out!

I find that coating the pills in food grade wax (spray) really helps with apperence and durability.

Hope you like it. i sure do

ApprenticeCook
(Hive Addict)
10-18-04 00:59
No 536265
      Looks good, would like some actual pictures of

Looks good, would like some actual pictures of it and a pic of product pills, when you get your camera working that is....

So the car press works well? whats the pill hardness like? good? i hate crumbly pills so this is of great concern to me, but method looks good so i might take a trip out and buy the parts.... excellent... thanks Agni.

Ill reserve my sincere congrats on the solution to many peoples problem (getting a damn press!) until either the photos come up to see it and example output or i build one as you said and test it...

So far though, good work.

-AC

Its just my opinion, but no-one listens to me anyway, and rightly so...

Agni
(Stranger)
10-18-04 02:24
No 536278
      the pills produced by my press and a 12ton...

the pills produced by my press and a 12ton hrdraluic shop press are great. no they are not crumbly. i threw the pills at the ground to test em and they didnt break cool , (linolium shop floor) ill get some pictures up as soon as i can, maybe a week or two. the spray on wax is definetly a good idea. before using any real pill powder in this thing i would recomend testing it with store bought pills ground to a fine powder, i orignialy tested it with asprin. i must emphasis fine powder, ballmilling really helps, try to stay away from using mostiure as a binder, when the pills dry out they could weaken, though the wax would definetly help.

Bwiti
(PVC-Analog Taste-Tester)
10-18-04 06:22
No 536302
User Picture       wax

Can stomach acid easily break-down a wax?

Love My Country, Fear My Government

hest
(Hive Adickt)
10-18-04 06:32
No 536304
      PillPress

12 T That's a lot of presure

A 1 hole pillpress with 50/50 MCC/Starch works fine with ½T Actual I thing that a 12T press on this mixture will yeald a pill that will come out of the body again as good as new
Post 513342 (drazik: "Herbal Vita-Press", Chemicals & Equipment)

indole_amine
(Hive Bee)
10-18-04 12:44
No 536344
User Picture       paraffin and digestion

Simple test: throw one of your pills into a beaker containing 1N HCl, and wait, swirling it every now and then. If it breaks apart and forms a nice fluffy pile of solids which slowly dissolve - nice.

But if nothing has happened after 30 minutes, the pills would maybe indeed be undestroyable - could perhaps be advertised as being the "rainproof outdoor variety" or something alike... crazy

And about digesting waxes: good ole merck index says "to cover food products; in floor polishes, cosmetics, electrical insulators; for extracting perfumes from flowers. Pharmaceutic aid (stiffening agent)" about paraffin wax. It is true that paraffin won't be metabolized; but unless huge amounts are used, it will just slow down the rate of digestion, avoiding that pills may crumble already while being swallowed. What I'm trying to say is: if it is good for covering food, it shouldn't hinder digestion at all. (apples usually are coated with a wax film to make them more appealing and resistant against air moisture, for example)

I have some vitamin/mineral dietary supplement pills that are hard as concrete - still they seem to dissolve pretty well upon ingestion... smile

(and even if your stomach doesn't crack them up; your intestine probably will...)

_{indole_amine}

pickler
(Greenhorn)
10-18-04 17:37
No 536390
User Picture       where have I heard this idea before?????

Post 370638 (pickler: "Cheap and easy pill press", General Discourse)

I went into the business for the money, and the art grew out of it.-Charlie Chaplin

jboogie
(Newbee)
10-18-04 20:46
No 536421
      it doesnt stop the pill from working!

Can stomach acid easily break-down a wax?
i dunno, but it doesnt stop the goodies from beeing absorbed! back in the day cool , when sqwid made pills, there werent any pill presses around. we just put the goodies in candy/food wax- called a "jelly roll". molly in the green, go-go in the reds... they were only the size of a penny or nickel and they came in five exciting flavors.
but back to the ?, the wax doesnt stop anything from working. and you werent eating like an ounce of wax, maybee 3/4 gram at most! the spray wax i was speaking of is a food grade edible wax, its very thin-has a low viscosity. some varieties even have antioxidents(vitC) in them,these are mostly found in the health food stores though.

methyl_ethyl
(Guardian)
10-19-04 00:32
No 536495
User Picture       USP Gastric Fluid, Simulated, Test Solution

I have been meaning to post this for some time, however I was waiting for the right thread. This thread seems to be a proper home for the following "recipe":

USP 27 NF 22

Gastric Fluid, Simulated- TS

Dissolve 2.0 g of sodium chloride and 3.2 g of purified pepsin, that is derived from porcine stomach mucosa, with an activity of 800 to 2500 units per mg of protein, in 7.0 mL of hydrochloric acid and sufficient water to make 1000 mL. [NOTE—Pepsin activity is described in the Food Chemicals Codex specifications under General Tests and Assays. ] This test solution has a pH of about 1.2.

laugh Just in case y'all really want to create a model for pressed pill digestion in humans that adheres to USP standards. Of course this should be used in conjunction with the USP dissolution apparatus Post 520145 (methyl_ethyl: "USP Dissolution Apparatus", Stimulants) that I have posted in the stimulants forum smile ....

regards,

m_e

   Unipolar Mania, It's good for life... laugh

scram
(Hive Bee)
10-19-04 05:50
No 536530
      70 to 85% active 4 to 5% stearic acid finely...

70 to 85% active
4 to 5% stearic acid finely mortered
12 to 25% micro cyrstalline cellulose
produce a 4.5 x 9.5mm pill with overall weight of ~240-270mg
shiny too. And yes it was too much for most people. But they liked it that way.

indole_amine
(Hive Bee)
10-19-04 10:13
No 536554
User Picture       crossreferencing

Methyl_Ethyl and Scram: YESSSS! That's exactly the info that was still lacking for a complete howto on tableting!! laugh

Pickler: but you didn't have the nice idea of equally sized input- and output-holes, did you? But lots of good info about pill binders in your old pillPress thread!

But in the same thread, someone mentioned the different pressures needed for different binders; according to him lactose was the only one suitable for pressures below 1T, whereas MCC required 5T+ for good results? (Scram?)

Also, they talk about engraving small logos onto the ends of the pressing rods... (what about maybe a BEE)? laugh

(Thanks for sharing your knowledge.)

And it seems some bee named Chicken is quite a professional in tableting:
Post 371152 (Chicken: "Powdered milk", General Discourse)

Post 371158 (Chicken: "Tablet specifications", General Discourse)

And another similar idea: Post 190249 (GlaseIs: "Design for a press", Chemicals & Equipment)

(strangely it looks EXACTLY like the one depicted here... smile )

_{indole_amine}

hest
(Hive Adickt)
10-20-04 06:01
No 536749
      Pills

70 to 85% active
4 to 5% stearic acid finely mortered
12 to 25% micro cyrstalline cellulose

That will make my DOM pill's quite small.
By the way Ballmilling the misture for 3-5H(plastic bottel, stealballs and an old dewalt) works greathe.
It's the MCC that's hold it all so high presure will aloud you to use less MCC and low presure mean that you need 50% MCC (it's not ekspencive, and that kg (for chromatographie) I bought will last my life

pooky
(Hive Bee)
10-25-04 21:05
No 537773
      Agni..

a very good idea but there is a simpler/faster/cheaper way.When P first started,P did basically the same thing except for there was a larger piece of 18" square steel 1/2 inch thick with 100 holes slowly(smoothly) drilled through it,P forgets the size-but small.This sat flush on another piece of steel the same size,and they were hinged and clamped together.Some nice very hard steel rods were cut about an 1.5inches high,these snugly fit into the holes and were polished flat on the pill end.
Get a small sledge/large ball peen hammer and experiment.Scrape in your favourite powder and you soon learn the weight/strokes and sound/higher note the pin makes when the tabs are where you want them.If P pounded the crap out of them (4 good swings) they were like stones.Then unhinge the thing and the tabs fall out.Pull out the pins,repowder,insert the pins and get beating.

P recommends making them a little strong and candy coating them if you want to get primo dollar with high demand..

Notes: you'll have to mess around with hole size vs. depth vs. dose + binder needed to fill the hole.When they are half full,bang the plate and some holes will settle more than others.
You can really produce with this...
P went on to buy a rotary press,but it had its finicky days...

...a cunning linguist and a master debater.

Agni
(Stranger)
10-26-04 04:08
No 537843
      candy coating

I like your idea of candy coating. did you brew up your own candy coating (if so how) or is there something you would like to recomend that can be bought (of course no sources etc...) Id love to make pills/candy and sell it on wax paper looking a lot like dot candy(?) believe acid was once sold liek that...

indole_amine
(Hive Bee)
10-26-04 12:23
No 537900
User Picture       no pressure while filling the holes!

Please make sure you don't bump the filled plate containing the unpressed pill mass on the ground; the only way to make sure all pills have the same weight/dose is to fill the chambers just flat off, don't stuff up anything. Just let the pill mass fall into the holes, and scrape away what didn't fall into them. Then press (a hammer is indeed a cool ghetto alternative, didn't think of that before!).

_{indole_amine}

ApprenticeCook
(Hive Addict)
10-26-04 12:44
No 537902
      Candy coating..... Hmm, couldnt you drop warm...

Candy coating.....

Hmm, couldnt you drop liquid sugar (tofee!) over the pressed pills? or what would adding a small amount of glycerol to the pill mix pre pressing do?

-AC

Its just my opinion, but no-one listens to me anyway, and rightly so...

jboogie
(Newbee)
10-26-04 18:49
No 537946
      candy coating...

ever eat any ritalin? or norpramin? or a half dozen other Rx's that are candy coated? lots of children meds have this coating to keep the kids from gaggin- most kids havent aquired a taste for amphetemines. im sure this wouldnt bee to hard to research.
In regards to pookie:
My press that i described was very similar; hinged with a backplate, small rods attached to a corrasponding plate, side lock. i never tried a hammer. i used the bench vice. once the contents were placed in the pill hole, the plate was locked and clamped in the vice till i couldnt turn it anymore. smile
another note: how bout those new alavert pills? they disolve on contact with spit/water and they taste good (as good as pills can taste...) and are handlable. any patent info here?

pooky
(Hive Bee)
10-26-04 19:25
No 537952
      Reply..

Agni: a candy coater is a rotating heated stainless tub/drum (seen them occasionally on online auction,you know the one, or google it to find a supplier)and P bought the coating from an industrial candy supplier-to which you add your own flavour/colouring.The smallest ones can do 50,000 at a time.The hot syrup is added in small amounts over several hours,then a little mineral oil or edible wax at the end to make 'em shine like Skittles.Yum Yum Yum.Some idiots claimed the reds were stronger than the blue ones.
You probably could ghetto one up from a mixing bowl/shaft/motor/halogen light for heat with much experimenting..but P saw one auction a month ago,ready to go-sold for $150.

Boogie: a vice is a fine way to press, but P found beating things to be therapeutic after thinking about the ex- girlfriend.

...a cunning linguist and a master debater.

jboogie
(Newbee)
10-26-04 21:30
No 537970
      to coat... see my above post for a ghetto...

to coat... see my above post for a ghetto surface coater. a trash bag blown up w/pills inside. add liquid and shake till coated. works alot better than you think. works on the ceasar salad principal.
BTW- to any nubees, the ceasar principal is not actully standard scientific practice... so dont UTFSE for info on it- check the food network. wink

pooky
(Hive Bee)
10-27-04 00:26
No 538006
      Also

P never thought to use a bag..good one.A thought..someone might be able to modify a salad spinner.

Also after P drilled all the holes,he ran a Dremel with a wool polisher and jeweller's rouge up and down each bore,fora very smooth surface.Pills are great,and it is fun to mess around-but if you are making them for yourself and a few friends,gel caps are worth looking into.Once you get the minions going on them and they are good,it doesn't matter.
P took a sheet of plexiglass and drilled 1000 holes through it.#3 gel caps were carefully measured for the height of the base and diameter of the top-the tops of the base caps were 2mm below the surface of the plexi--favourite dust was scraped in (to yield a 120 mg dose)all the top caps were put in/on and a small foam paintroller was rolled all over to close them up.Tipped over,bagged and started over.Can do 2000 gels an hour by yourself this way.
P suggests 10 holes for the personal/friends user.

...a cunning linguist and a master debater.

jboogie
(Hive Bee)
10-29-04 19:15
No 538589
      i saw this and immedantly thought of the pill...

i saw this and immedantly thought of the pill press.
http://www.ganjaland.com/ganjastore.htm
scroll down to the press section. "PP 005T polinator press"- fuck payin that much for a jack. but checkout the idea and make a tray to hold the press. how easy do you think that would bee to recreate with a car jack and long bolts from X-Mart. probably like $60. it provides 5 tons, which is more than enough. thought it might bee some inspiration. cool

diacetylmorphomaniac

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