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All 15 posts   Subject: Sudafed : Metho + dH20 = No More! (OzBeez)   Please login to post   Down

10-14-04 11:58
No 535807
      Sudafed : Metho + dH20 = No More! (OzBeez)     

OK, well, seems within the last 3 weeks, most new orders of Sudafed *originals* have been modified and now include hems which kill a meth extraction. <continued>

It looks like the original extraction of Pseudo-ephedrine from Sudafed (Nasal & Decongestant (60mg x 30)) is No longer possible. From what I know which may already be common knowledge to the rest of the planet is PEG being the culprit of failed rxn's. Although looking all nice and normal when reacting and filtering the rp, as soon as your solvent and lye are added, expect a nice green cheddar cheese like emulsion to own your batch. Possibility of Povidone also being added as expecting a minimum total of 6g's at the end of the cook, ended up being no more than .4 from each pull attempted. All pulls + Peroxide added to push the oil into the solvent, the total yield was no more than 1g.

SWIM's comments refer to the ORIGINAL sudafeds in the squarish packets, the tablets, not the caps.

NO physical changes are noticed, the size of the pill, the stamp and the box remain exactly the same.

DO not be fooled, as I no doubt have been and have wasted my HI.

This scenario kicking in all doubt about considering any future cooks.

Any comments, or insults, please post.

In all n all, gratitude towards all bees within the forum, from no knowledge and nothing more than ambition taking control has lead me from a newbie with no comprehension of the reaction to a newbie with some comprehension and now having the knowledge to complete a rxn successfully *appart from this time* :: May the world be blessed by methamphetamines, sex and single white females:)

- Martian_A

* peekin from a dud cook? im a dero.
10-15-04 03:17
No 535907
      Really? not shit sherlock, metho pulls dont...     

Really? not shit sherlock, metho pulls dont work. Get up to date.
And dont you understand the rules? NO SOURCES means "NO SOURCES"

I wouldnt of been suprised if you told me that metho pulls wernt working a YEAR ago.

If thats what you've been doing down here in oz then you have a very tough road in front of you.
(Hive Bee)
10-15-04 09:13
No 535938
User Picture 
      This may be a bit off topic, but anyhow swim...     

This may be a bit off topic, but anyhow swim don't see how you Oz bees seem to think that we have pill extraction easy?  Yes we do have inactive labels.  No they do not list all the gakks, either.

Dude if H2o/methanol pulls just quit working for ya, then you have been one lucky sonofagun!  After all, I can't assume that an OZ bee would settle for sub-par gear from non-pristene precursors.wink

Even though I promised BlackBmw and p1e2r3f4e5c6t7 that I would keep my american ass out of Ozzy pill threads, but if that is all you guys have been dealing with then I can see why I was told to but out.  I just simply wasn't needed.laugh  I don't understand the pill situation down under.  Do you guys even have Eudragit yet?

Some solutions for yer gakk:PEG can be eliminated by a Naptha simmer, not sure the proper sub for that in OZ.  If povidone is present a 24 hr. xylene soak will rid it.  The anti-hists in the sixties are soluble in Acetone and MEK.  A couple of boils and they'll bee history. 

Before you decide on any method, note that one any older than four months won't work on the Eudragit gakk.  Their are many methods in the stim faq.Post 408293 (Rhodium: "The Stimulants Forum FAQ", Stimulants)

Uncle Fester and EvilScripter69 both have doable cures for the new nasty.Post 529156 (evilscripter69: "Best extraction method. well tested", Stimulants)Post 501189 (UncleFester: "publishing emergency", Stimulants)(this is Fester's first actualy experiement in the thread)

It makes me stand UP, move around
(arrogant bee of the day)
10-15-04 10:22
No 535947
User Picture 
      abominator, You better stay out of the Oz...     

You better stay out of the Oz threads.

If this guy has only realized that the old ways of methos pulls aren't possible anymore, then he either just finished working his way through a very old stockpile of pills or he is admitting that he is one of these oldtime oz cooks (hypo) that used to get away with making that peanut butter shit that they call pure.

Before you reply, the hypo (and Birch)) reaction(s) are renowned for being able to have very reasonable outcomes with very substandard precurser. So either he used to make really bad gear like peanut butter, or up until now he was using an old stockpile of pills. Because those pills as far back as I remember (6-7 years) have alwasy required more then EtOH and/or H2O.

So which is it, old pills or you make crap?

The reason I want to know is I would love to hear from an Oz cook that makes or used to make that crap. Because we only make pure crystals here. But I have never heard from one that makes or used to make that 10:1 crap that was considered the norm in Australia years ago. Still, I can't complain, if it wasn't for that crap, I might not have been interested in learning the truth.

It's not really me, it's Android in disguise!
(Hive Addict)
10-15-04 13:54
No 535965
User Picture 
      I'll be nice... :•ю     

Frankly...I don't give a rats ass where the bee is from globally!
I won't hesitate to help another bee with possible solutions!
I was one of the first to warn against what would occur in GUPchucking birch reductions and tried to sway bees the world over toward better extraction practices that didn't produce PeanutButter Crank riddled with siderxn gaak and impurities.
Abominator has every right to point out successful extraction methods that are aimed toward providing International relief for the newer gaaks!
And placebo is right about one thing...Older pillstocks provide relief for a time but those that like to getcaught with their pants down....keep applying old methods on newer formulations.
The info that will help a US bee stands a better chance at helping an OZ bee than just applying the OZ ways from days of old!
I don't see you placebo coming up with any new work-arounds for your fellow countrybees.

There is a new gaak that will be encountered internationally.
It's a combination Of sorbates(TWEEN 60-80) and various
weight PEGS 200-600-800-1000. This is combined with the layering of OI-OII-Eudragit gaaks in the same formulation.
This inhibits amine movement as well as interfering with the crystalization process.
It is pH activated and will survive most types of reduction only to be encountered post-rxn.
Front side A/B'ing processes help but will cost in yields of usable pfed due to anti-xtalling and encapsulation.
For those that skate by the OII-Eudragit in their extraction process, start looking toward methods aimed at  sidestepping Polysorbate encapsulation.
Never shut yourselves out of newer processes based solely on GlobalRegion!
We're all in the boat together and should act as such!
And Placebo: If you took offense to anything I've said your breath because any rebuttal will likely fall on deft ears. At least in Ibees corner.
Those quick to turn away any offers of help... either...
a)NEED HELPIn MORE ways than one!
b)Don't deserve it!

If the shoethrows fits...Ware Itout
10-22-04 17:22
No 537170
      How about ya's S&*K my D&CK?     

Listen to ya's, acting like ya's have it all figured out. Here's a bit of a wake up call to you morons who seem know it all. The NEWLY MODIFIED SHIT has NOT been an issue until of recent, Not a year ago, not 6 months ago, but within the last 4 weeks! Yes, fair enough, you yanks have it harder than we do/did! As said, They have just hit our shelves of recent! The other gakked pills have been around for a long while now, although with the Original ones having no issues until recent, there was no need to persue any other method to extract the pseudoephedrine. YES, Methylated Spirits, DH20 & Acetone were the oldskool way of extractions, and they STILL worked PERFECTLY until recent. ALL Reactions done with that extraction technique, were reacted without issue! Therefore, any harsh stupidity comments are not needed as ya'll are the ones assuming that they were here for the last year and that we needed to throw harder cleaning methods on it even though it simply was never neccessory. Get your facts right, the post was simply to alert the locals.

& No! My reactions are 12 Hr Reflux using E/HI/RP. Fuck the Birch Reaction! You lemme know where to find Dry NH3 in Oz and ill reward you with a queer blowie.

wareami, you been the only decent character on this board appart from jackhole. Rest have attitudes, no doubt drug induced.. Respect! :)

I welcome any help/tips/comments you may have!

- Martian_A
(Hive Bee)
10-22-04 18:59
No 537185
User Picture 
      Re: YES, Methylated Spirits, DH20 & Acetone...     

YES, Methylated Spirits, DH20 & Acetone were the oldskool way of extractions, and they STILL worked PERFECTLY until recent. ALL Reactions done with that extraction technique, were reacted without issue! Therefore, any harsh stupidity comments are not needed as ya'll are the ones assuming that they were here for the last year and that we needed to throw harder cleaning methods on it even though it simply was never neccessory.

If you or any ozbee had been so kind as to have made that clear some time ago, then there would be no confusion.  

How did what I said come off as "attitude"?0 One thing you got right Martian, my attitude is for the most part drug induced.tongue  I got no beefs with your methods or reason to doubt your claims more than anyone else's on this board.

Bestest Wishezwink

Makes me stand UP/move around

(Hive Bee)
10-22-04 20:08
No 537193
User Picture 

I don't see you placebo coming up with any new work-arounds for your fellow countrybees.

'cebo has long since passed his Hive apprenticeship... laugh

SWIX on the other hand is still studying. There will come a day, beelieve me, when SWIX will bee contributing again.... wink

New laws coming into effect here. Soon to bee new gakks showing up here me thinks. SWIX hopes to look into this soon for local beez...


Reality is just a crutch for people who can't handle drugs...
10-23-04 22:43
No 537337
      oz pills     

I too have had the same problems over the last 4 weeks and I use the sulphate pills. All was fine until the last 4 weeks.A friend of mine who lives in S.A. was using sudafeds 6 months ago with no problems and he just used metho to extract.I was there and I even bought some of the packets for him and tried the end result.Must have been old stock, rubbish!It amazes me some of the dribble that occasionally spews from some of the older bees.Didn't your mother teach you that if you haven't got anything nice(or constructive) then hold your tounge.Crap like that relly spoils the read. Sure, be objective, flame if you really must, but otherwise, SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!
(Hive Addict)
10-29-04 02:25
No 538419
User Picture 
      lsd and other downunderz...     

It would surely benefit the OZbees here in this forum if y'all could source tetrachlorethylene(aka...perchloroethylene) and begin using it in your extractions. It's primary attackmode is geared toward getting some nasty polymers out of the way.
I do realize that most of the labeling of consumer products over there, pretty much sucks for you blokes!
But when armed with the right chems, in the right'd be surprised what can be accomplished.
Even to this day...I still have OZ bees asking for tetra sources.
I'm not over that makes for a big obstacle....but I do know other OZ bees are using it successfully, so they must be getting it somewhere.
The latest formulation assaults on pills the world over are high tech and require some fancy footwork to obtain clean feedstock!
Experimentation is the key!
Some of the most recent methods are working on OZ pills and US pills!
The GO`ing will always get tough at times...
That's just a sign that the tough gotta get tougher if they wanna keep GO`ing!cool

If the shoethrows fits...Ware Itout
10-29-04 07:53
No 538488
      There is a really easy obvious pure source of...     

There is a really easy obvious pure source of Perch here, just look guys.
(Comandante A)
11-05-04 02:03
No 539767
User Picture 

I'm not over that makes for a big obstacle....but I do know other OZ bees are using it successfully, so they must be getting it somewhere.

.......and if they wanna keep getting it, they better keep it to themselves.

Wareami, you should remember to remind yourself that most of the Australians in the Hive are morons that continually blab about sources in public.
(Hive Bee)
11-05-04 03:41
No 539781
User Picture 
      Isd isnt bullshiting........     

Swis is known to sometimes hang in SA, and up until last month, was able to just do a water/methanol pull on  generic 120's and 30's.  granted he had stockpiled, but the pills that started GAKing were the brand new ones.  quality had been like allways, and it burned clean.  yields were constant. now its like Pooof!!!!!  its all to hell.  he is back on track with the help of some very kind  but damn it takes a hell of a lot longer to dream the dream!!  his only problem now is finding KOH.  he knows where to look, but not what hes looking for (could a bee pm him?)  anyways, have been using 50/50 sodium hydroxide/KCI salt substitute (which is a bitch to find!) in its place, but has heard of better yields with the real mccoy.

may the meth godz smile upon me or i shall sleep long time
11-12-04 03:57
No 541153
      Re - 6 Hours     

10 packs of 6 hours sulphates used.
Worked up as dry acid/base on Evilscripters page using TCE/PCE.(took all of two hours to locate and I'm very remote).
5 grams of freebase was net result.
Reacted dry for a couple of hours.
2.5 grams end product.
Not too bad a kick but not like it used to.
End product must be kept in freezer as does not like staying solid at room temp (28 degrees Celcius - go the metric).
(Hive Addict)
11-12-04 04:30
No 541155
User Picture 
      PEG/PS80 Layer...     

In the States they have taken to including a Polysorbate/PEG layering that seems to inhibit drying of the xtals! The xtals form...but soon weaken it would seem.
As a suggested way to deal with this, if it's found to be the case is to employ MEK rinses somewhere in the pre-rxn extraction.MEK seems to steal pfed so it's important to save the collected rinses and then rehit with more MEK rinses after the initial collections are evapped and scraped UP.
Not sure if this will help but in a world where every little bit can't be afraid of throwing the kitchen sink at the fuckers in the search for what works and what doesn'tcool

If the shoethrows fits...Ware Itout

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